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Restatements still not done


Rai401k
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We use the pre-approved corbel documents, and we are coming close to the end of the year, unfortunetly it’s going to be close to impossible for us to get all of our restatements done and signed by 12/31/2009.

If we start using an effective date of 1/1/2010 we know that we have only until 4/30/2010 to have those documents signed unlike having till the end of the year for our 1/1/2009 documents, but what other disadvantages would there be for not having all our restatements done by the end of this year?

Is it true that we still have to have the PPA amendment signed by 12/31/2009, we are currently sending them out with our restatements?

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Guest Sieve

If you have any voluntary changes you want to institute in pye 12/31/2009 along with the EGTRRA restatement, you won't be able to do that if you sign after 12/31/2009 with an effective date of 1/1/2010. Other than that, I can think of no disadvantage to completing the EGTRRA restatements in 2010--other than the separate mailing you will have to do for the PPA 12/31/2009 deadline.

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Guest Sieve

K2 --

Corbel is designed so that the appropriate effective dates of EGTRRA changed provisions are indicated in the document, so you are to use a current effective date--that's how Corbel always has done it. Here's what Corbel says: "This [EGTRRA restatement] plan is designed so that the restatement effective date may be a current date. For example, if a calendar year plan is being restated in 2008, then the effective date of the restatement may be January 1, 2008. Using a current effective date avoids the need to reflect changes that have been made to the plan since the last time it was restated (other than changes required by law)."

As indicated in the last sentence of the above quote, if you make the effective date of the restatement 1/1/2002, for example, then what do you do about changes you made to the plan by amendment effective 1/1/2004, or 1/1/2006 (like adding hardship distributions, or loans)? So, you make it effective currently (2009 or 2010), and the doucment takes care of the rest. Otherwise, be careful.

Not all prototype/VS documents are handled in a similar fashion, however.

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Larry,

What you describe is exactly what we were expecting, but we were told we must use 1-1-2002 for the effective date in the Corbel prototype. We had lengthy discussion with their legal team who insisted that was right and that language is included to cover changes that happened between 1-1-2002 and the execution date of the restatement. We have now written over 6,000 documents that way, and I still disagree with their analysis!

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k2retire,

I believe you are using the Corbel PPD prototype documents, in that case you are correct. We use the Volume Submitter IDP document in which the 2002 dates are hard coded in according to Corbel. We have had this discussion with them because i noticed it in a document I received for a conversion from another TPA. I notice that they used 2002 as the effective date for the EGTRRA restatement. When I called Corbel they let me know that this was unique to thier PPD protype documetns only.

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Guest Sieve

K2 --

Strange. That advise is contrary to what Corbel's "Adoption Agreement Guide" says (which is the language I quoted, above).

But there may be an explanation . . . With 6,000 plans, I assume that your Corbel prototype was tweaked by your legal department before it was submitted to the IRS in your (company's) name, so perhaps your prototype is somewhat different from the vanilla Corbel prototype that most other organziations use. That may make a retroactive effective date proper in your case, with your plan document. Is that a possibility?

I didn't know about the PPD document effective date. That's an even better (?) explanation.

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Guest Sieve

A bank restatement I reveiwed for a client a few weeks ago had an effective date of 5/1/2002 (5/1-4/30 plan year). I asked the Bank why, and they pointed to language they had added to the "Special Effective Date" line of an Addendum to the Plan which states:

"Although the Plan's restated Effective Date is the first day of the Plan Year beginning in 2002, or, if later, the original Effective Date of the Plan, this Adoption Agreement reflects Plan elections that are in effect on the date the EGTRRA restatement of this Plan is adopted. As to elections that may have been in effect before the EGTRRA restatement of this Plan is adopted . . . see the Plan as in effect prior to its restatment."

First one I've ever seen like that. Must be a PPD document, I guess.

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  • 2 months later...
Guest Sieve

One of my clienets (a TPA) has about 325 plans, adn they started about a year or so ago. Only about 3 or 4 stkill remain to be restated (because the person who does them is anal).

As for my own clients, I'm in tune with WDIK's approach.

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thanks for the feedback guys.... I felt like l was the only one still working on them...alot of people i've spoken to had them done in mid 2009. So I felt like I was so behind.

we are a fairly small TPA ....it's my responsibilty to get all the restatemetns done. I had about 225 to do .... doesn't seem like alot compared to 8,000 :o but it has taken me since May of last year to get 125 ...... 100 more to go. Hopefully I can get them done by April :blink:

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So we're almost there, but I still have a lot of restatement left ...about 100 more. Just curious to see where everyone else is at? Am I the only one still working on these crazy restatements!! Can't wait till this is over!!!

I have alot more to do and i am working like crazy. if i had until the end of june i would feel alot better.

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...
Out of approx. 2600 plans, we have less than 200 left. We did make plan design suggestions on the majority of plans, so most of the ones that are left are ones that just haven't responded. All in all, I'm feeling pretty good about where we're at!

i have about 120 left. if you are submitting they must be submitted by april 30. that makes the time left a lot shorter. i wish they would give a 2 month extension.

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Guest Sieve

Remember the last GUST extension?: (i) you have to submit for an FDL if you restate during the extended X month period, and (ii) you incur a separate and additional fee (I think it was $350) when you submit. I suspect that's not the kind of extension people are looking for.

Since this is now part of the 6-year cycle procedure, I personally do not believe there will be an extension. (But, I hope I'm wrong!)

We should have an over/under "poll" for (i) date of issuance of extension, and (ii) length of the extension. Winner is ERISA King/Queen (take your pick) for the day, and gets a toaster.

edited to correct a typo

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