Flyboyjohn Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 Employer offers HDHP with maximum family deductible and out-of-pocket of $13,100. Employer funds maximum HSA for family coverage of $6,750. Can employer also offer a Medical Expense Reimbursement Plan for the spread? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyboyjohn Posted October 11, 2017 Author Share Posted October 11, 2017 Found the answer to my question: Yes, employer can use an HRA to reimburse the spread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
My 2 cents Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 19 minutes ago, Flyboyjohn said: Found the answer to my question: Yes, employer can use an HRA to reimburse the spread Knowing nothing about the applicable rules, while I am glad that you found your answer, I am curious about what MOOP might be. What a silly-sounding acronym! Always check with your actuary first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david rigby Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 26 minutes ago, Flyboyjohn said: Found the answer to my question: Yes, employer can use an HRA to reimburse the spread Perhaps you can help by describing where you found the answer, for the benefit of others. I'm a retirement actuary. Nothing about my comments is intended or should be construed as investment, tax, legal or accounting advice. Occasionally, but not all the time, it might be reasonable to interpret my comments as actuarial or consulting advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyboyjohn Posted October 11, 2017 Author Share Posted October 11, 2017 MOOP is shorthand for Maximum Out of Pocket. Answer was in IRS Publication 969 under the section dealing with what other health plans are permissible in conjunction with an HSA (referred to by IRS as "Post-deductible health FSA or HRA"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Presson Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I clicked just to see if the answer was actually MOOR and not MOOP. William C. Presson, ERPA, QPA, QKA bill.presson@gmail.com C 205.994.4070 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acm_acm Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 On 10/11/2017 at 5:18 PM, My 2 cents said: Knowing nothing about the applicable rules, while I am glad that you found your answer, I am curious about what MOOP might be. What a silly-sounding acronym! The Moops invaded Spain and were driven out by Ferdinand and Isabella. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XTitan Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 I thought MOOP was just a more polite way to say bullsh*t - There are two types of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data sets... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belgarath Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 I got an image of strange looking (but identical in appearance) Dr. Seuss creatures playing in a field, MOOPS and MOPES. "It's pretty hard telling the MOOPS from the MOPES, but the MOOPS play with hoops and the MOPES play with ropes." Or something equally ridiculous. I think I need therapy... hr for me 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpod Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 That answer (from Pub. 969) surprises me, because it seems to be inconsistent with the policy behind HDHPs and HSAs. Assuming that is the correct answer, I find it hard to believe that the employer's cost in funding the HSAs and the "MOOPs" would be less than the cost of health insurance with no or a very low deductible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiritrider Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 First, a small correction for the OP. The employer can actually offer a plan that covers the spread between the minimum allowed deductible and the max OOP, not just between the HSA maximum contribution limit and the max OOP. This is a common plan and referred to as a post-deductible HRA and is similar to the concept of a post-deductible FSA. To answer jpod's post: This is not at all inconsistent with HDHP/HSA code/regulations. "Other coverage" is only disqualifying if it pays/reimburses before the minimum allowed HDHP deductible. These are 2017 = $1300 Individual/$2600 Family and 2018 = $1350 Individual/2700 family. Finally, while totally self-insured plans are usually only the province of very large employers, an HDHP/HSA/(post-deductible and/or limited HRA) can be very cost effective for the employer and beneficial for the employees. Self-insuring a higher deductible above the minimums and the maximum OOP will cost far less than having an insurance company do so. After all, the insurance company is making a profit. Many medium -> large sized businesses can benefit from such constructs. Flyboyjohn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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