Windows Vista/Computer

[Andy the Actuary]

Help. I'm contemplating purchasing a new computer. While I know my way around the block with applications, I'm of little use with hardware and operating systems. My only decision is to buy a PC rather than a MAC. In my business applications, I use a lot of antiquated systems such as Multimate Word Processor, Paradox (DOS version), and programs written in FORTRAN. In short, a lot of DOS applications. For pleasure, I use ITunes, Windows Media, Real Player, music splicers, etc.

I currently operate a 4 year old HP Pavilion which has served me faithfully but I'm hesitant to push the envelope.

(1) I have heard a lot of grumbling about Windows Vista and how dredful it is. Of course, those who grumble are unable to articulate that they can no longer run certain applications. I note from just playing around on the computers at Best Buy that Vista does offer a DOS shell so would suspicion no problem. Clearly, the layout and commands are different.

Has anyone experienced problems with VISTA?

Can I buy a new computer loaded with VISTA, remove VISTA, and load XP? I've heard you can't do this.

(2) I note that Dell still offers computers with XP. I've heard grumblings about Dell but again no specifics. Money is secondary to reliability and from what I can see from Dell, by the time you get done on a high-powered computer, you haven't saved much. Any Dell users like to give testimony one way or another?

Any comments will be especially appreciated and if you have concerns about making them public, please email me at:

arochman@att.net

Thank You,

Andy Rochman

St. Louis, MO

[TPAnnie]

(1) I have heard a lot of grumbling about Windows Vista and how dredful it is. Of course, those who grumble are unable to articulate that they can no longer run certain applications. I note from just playing around on the computers at Best Buy that Vista does offer a DOS shell so would suspicion no problem. Clearly, the layout and commands are different.

Has anyone experienced problems with VISTA?

Can I buy a new computer loaded with VISTA, remove VISTA, and load XP? I've heard you can't do this.

Hi Andy,

I purchased a laptop to connect to my office via SSL. At the time, my office's version of SSL was not supporting Vista - unfortunately, I didn't know that until too late. So, my only problem with Vista was self-inflicted, however I'd heard many horror stories myself.

To solve my problem, I removed Vista completely and installed a brand new full version of XP Pro. My office had purchased a few extra licenses, so I had no financial issues holding me back. I do not think I would have done this if I had to pay the couple of hundred to purchase a new license. After installing, I had to find/load all my drivers for XP rather than Vista, but I was able to pull these all from the internet. I can't remember all the steps, but I just googled instructions and they were very easy to follow. So, though I'm not too helpful in providing you instructions, I know it can be done successfully.

Good luck!!

[JanetM]

Andy,

Our company tested Vista in late 2006/early 2007. Pulled the plug on all those testing because is was a dud. Wasn't working with our email, Oracle systems, or even other Microsoft programs.

Because of that I had a computer guy build me a new system in Feb 2007 just so I could get widows xp. Many friends of mine bought new computers in 2007 and they all came with Vista. Almost everyone of them ended up buying XP to replace Vista.

[Andy the Actuary]

Thank you for taking the time to comment.

Has anyone found that you cannot load XP onto a computer that was delivered with Vista installed????

[masteff]

For the sake of dissenting opinion, let me take a moment...

I've found that only a few features in Vista are truly obnoxious... and were easy to turn off once I took a moment to find out how (Aero desktop theme and User Account Control to name two specifically). Only our payroll software was non-Vista compatible and that was solved by using a virtual machine (an installation of XP that runs inside a shell in Vista).

I now have Vista at work and at home. I'm perfectly content w/ it in both places.

Now, your question about "can it be impossible to load XP on a Vista machine?" Yes. The problem arises if the hardware is very new and therefore doesn't have XP compatible drivers. This will become a bigger and bigger problem as time goes by.

If you choose to buy a computer loaded w/ Vista and then revert to XP, I'd encourage you to find various user forums on the internet where people have posted their own experiences w/ that model of computer.... and more importantly have posted links to where they found the necessary drivers. (Suggestion #2 is that you not reformat the Vista harddrive but instead buy a new harddrive, swap the drives and use the new one, leaving the Vista one in case you reach a point you can't get XP to work. That's the biggest mistake I've seen on the Dell forum "help, I reformatted my harddrive and now I can't do anything".)

A word of caution (and this is the only really techie thing I'll say), many new computers have a SATA RAID controller build into the motherboard and, to install XP, you have to have the RAID drivers on a floppy/cd so the OS can recognize the harddrive via the RAID controller. W/out the RAID drivers, you can be dead in the water before you even get started. Again, a computer user forum can help you help you figure out ahead of time if this is an issue w/ a particular brand/model and help you locate the proper driver.

[mwyatt]

We've pulled back on purchasing anything w/ Vista for the last year due to concerns arising from our pension software vendors (let's face it: we're in a pretty small niche world here - Relius/Datair et al have fewer licenses sold per year than the big boys do in a day). We've fixed existing or turned to a local white box shop rather than buying anything precanned w/ Vista.

That being said, MS did provide the MS Virtual Machine software for free. I did have a post earlier on this program (which also runs on XP)

MS Virtual machine

Problem w/ running older DOS programs on Vista/XP machines is some of them will want to load specific drivers in CONFIG.SYS or AUTOEXEC.BAT (remember those) which don't exist. I had an old copy of Windows 98 lying around and w/ the Virtual Machine was able to access an old pension system for archival data that we couldn't load on XP either.

That being said, in our little world w/ little software vendors, make sure that you check w/ their requirements before proceeding w/ Vista to avoid problems. Anyone else not surprised that MS, Intel, AMD et al sucking wind over the last year due to hesitant business new purchases?

[Guest KennyH]

Thank you for taking the time to comment.

Has anyone found that you cannot load XP onto a computer that was delivered with Vista installed????

I have done just that on a new laptop I purchased. No problems since I did it last month.

[Guest justicejayant x]

I dont like Windows vista because its slow in my pc.

[Andy the Actuary]

Thank you all. The decision was to purchase a DELL with XP to ensure compatibility. Thanks for all the comments.

andy t.a.