IRS Notice - 2008 Form 5500 not received

[Spencer]

Client just received IRS notice stating they never received the Form 5500 for 2008. Client does not have signed copy in their files. They were not our client then and all HR personnel has changed. However, owner says he remembers signing form.

I am not comfortable with client backdating signature. So is their only option DFVCP? any other thoughts?

Thanks!

[Andy the Actuary]

1. Try www.freeerisa.com to determine if they have record. If so, it was filed and you can send them copy and refer to the website.

2. ASSUMING that filings have always been timely, reply to IRS with your story that have always been timely and that due to massive changes in personnel, copies of forms cannot be located. Include signed form with present date, tell them your client is dating in good faith rather than backdating, and ask that the IRS accept.

[Spencer]

Thanks, Andy.

freeerisa.com did not have 2008 Form 5500 so we wil use option 2.

[Andy the Actuary]

Thanks, Andy.

freeerisa.com did not have 2008 Form 5500 so we wil use option 2.

Good luck. I've found as long as client has solid history of timely filing, IRS is forgiving.

[Kevin C]

Does the letter say what to do if the form was already filed? The letters I've seen like that usually say if the form was filed, then send them a new signed copy of the return and tell them when it was filed. That is basically ATA's option 2, but I wouldn't necessarily assume it wasn't mailed just because it isn't in the system. We've had them lose filings where the client sent it with a return receipt and received the receipt showing it was delivered.

[Andy the Actuary]

Does the letter say what to do if the form was already filed? The letters I've seen like that usually say if the form was filed, then send them a new signed copy of the return and tell them when it was filed. That is basically ATA's option 2, but I wouldn't necessarily assume it wasn't mailed just because it isn't in the system. We've had them lose filings where the client sent it with a return receipt and received the receipt showing it was delivered.

Agree with Kevin though you are assumed guilty until you prove yourself innocent. And without documentation that you mailed the 5500 (or even a signed file copy), how do you do that?

[Kevin C]

I don't recall them ever asking for documentation or proof of when the form was mailed. Have you had them ask for proof?

[Guest cbclark]

A client called yesterday to tell us that they had gotten a similar letter regarding the 2008 form 5500. This letter specified that if the form had been filed, the client was to complete Section I of the Notice and mail or fax it. Section I asks for name and address of sponsor, name of plan, EIN and plan number. It also asks for date form was filed with EBSA and Acknowledgement number. Luckily the client sent the form in with a return receipt requested and had the signed return form. We have no idea what the "Acknowledgement number" is and are hopeful that the copy of the signed return form will be sufficient. I am grateful for clients who actually follow our recommendations about proof of filing/proof of service etc.

[MarZDoates]

We had the same situation for a 2007 5500. The client completed section I of the IRS notice, included a cover letter and a signed/dated copy of the 2007 5500 demonstrating it was filed timely.

The IRS kicked it back stating that it needed to be efiled, basically ignoring the cover letter.

We efiled with a pdf "other" attachment consisting of cover letter explaining that it was filed timely, a signed copy of the 2007 return and a copy of the IRS notice. Client received penalty assessment letter for late filing.

We called the IRS from the client's office and explained the situation. It was finally resolved without penalty, but took at least 6 months.

I guess my point is NOT to include a copy of the 5500....just complete part I of the IRS notice.

[Guest cbclark]

We had batted back and forth the idea of sending a copy of the signed 5500 and then decided nope, send exactly what is asked for on the notice. Client was a little bit squirmy and itchy with sending in only what the form wanted, s/he wanted to resend the whole entire filing....auditor's report and all.....With your experience MarZ I am really glad we did not include the form! We shall see if the lean version works..........