Mike Preston Posted June 5, 2002 Posted June 5, 2002 One can NOT pay out on the basis of GATT prior to the amendment being adopted and effective.
AndyH Posted June 5, 2002 Posted June 5, 2002 Mike, just to make sure I understand your point on the RAP, assume: Calendar year plan Had PBGC rates as lump sum basis Not amended for GATT or GUST until 12/2001 Are you saying that under current guidance that an amendment in 2001 to replace PBGC with GATT is invalid, that we are locked into PBGC rates permanently, or at least based upon benefits accrued through the amendment date? If so there will be mass non-compliance.
Mike Preston Posted June 5, 2002 Posted June 5, 2002 Gee, I don't think I said that. Did I? I said that by adopting the amendment to eliminate PBGC after 12/31/99, you can use the same time frame to determine your GATT rate that you used to determine your PBGC rate f you want to avoid 1 one year period where you must provide for 411d6 protection. Under the regs, I think you can also use a one month or a two month lookback and still avoid 411d6. But if you want to use a 5 month lookback, you will have to provide a one year period where participants get the best of both worlds.
AndyH Posted June 6, 2002 Posted June 6, 2002 ok, thanks. Speed reading did me in I guess. Thanks for the clarification. From the number of readers of this post, I would have guessed something radical was discovered.
Gary Posted June 6, 2002 Posted June 6, 2002 andy, i'm with you. i interpreted mike's piror thread as you did. and now after mike's last thread it seems we are back on track and cnsistent with what we thought all along.
Guest Keith N Posted June 7, 2002 Posted June 7, 2002 Throwing a little gasoline on this..... I just talked to an attorney friend who is handling several plan terminations and he said that two separate IRS agents (Calif. & Cincinnati) are giving him problems relating to the change from PBGC rates to GATT. The agents are referencing an “internal IRS memo” that states that ANY amendment which potentially increases an employers reversion of excess assets on plan termination can not take effect until 5-years after it’s adoption, INCLUDING the statutory change to GATT rates. These plans were timely amended for GATT, but the reviewing agents are saying that the amendment can't take effect for 5-years. Anyone else had this problem?
Blinky the 3-eyed Fish Posted June 7, 2002 Posted June 7, 2002 This topic was just addressed in this post. http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=15056 "What's in the big salad?" "Big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs."
AndyH Posted June 7, 2002 Posted June 7, 2002 I'd call it discussed rather than addressed. Our legal people are looking at me cross eyed when I showed them that thread. The memo seems to be contagious among IRS agents. Does anyone know if it is online?
david rigby Posted June 7, 2002 Posted June 7, 2002 Rather than the link above, let's try this similar, and longer, discussion thread. http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=15057 I'm a retirement actuary. Nothing about my comments is intended or should be construed as investment, tax, legal or accounting advice. Occasionally, but not all the time, it might be reasonable to interpret my comments as actuarial or consulting advice.
Blinky the 3-eyed Fish Posted June 7, 2002 Posted June 7, 2002 Rule 1: Always check the link you post. "What's in the big salad?" "Big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs."
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