Message Boards Digest

May 8, 2018

Here are the most recently added topics on the BenefitsLink Message Boards:

Author's photo

Gadgetfreak created a topic in ERPA (Enrolled Retirement Plan Agent)

ERPA CE Requirements: Confusion Over Which Years Are Involved

On 10/18/17, I received my ERPA renewal letter from the IRS. It says it was issued on 10/1/17 and expires 9/30/20. To the left of that same page, it says, under CE Requirements: "Annual CE Cycle: January through December". I know that the requirements are 72 hours with a min of 16 per year and 2 of ethics per year. What constitutes each of the three years? Is it 1/1/17-12/31/17, 1/1/18-12/31/18 and 1/1/19-12/31/19? Is it 1/1/18-12/31/18, 1/1/19-12/31/19 and 1/1/20-12/31/20? Is it 10/1/17-9/30/18, 10/1/18-9/30/19 and 10/1/19-9/30/20? I think it should be the first but it's very confusing. Any thoughts?
Number of replies posted  4 replies      Number of times viewed  40 views      Add Reply

Free ASC CE Credit Webcast!

Sponsored by ASC
Join us to review new PPA documents, the new restatement process and timing requirements: Volume Submitter Defined Benefit Plan, Volume Submitter Cash Balance Plan and Volume Submitter Defined Benefit - Governmental Plan. Register Now at No Cost!
Author's photo

calexbraska created a topic in Nonqualified Deferred Compensation

Top Hat Filing for Subsequent Plans

We did a top hat filing when we established our first top hat plan. The regulations state, "Only one statement need be filed for each employer maintaining one or more of the plans described in paragraph (d) of this section." Based on that language, it appears we do not have to do any additional top hat filings when we establish new top hat plans. Normally we do anyway as best practice, but in this case we didn't and we've already missed the 120 day window to file. Does it make sense to do a late top hat filing? Would that just raise a red flag? Or is it better to just rely on the language from the regulations and take the position that no top hat filings are required for the later-adopted plans?
Number of replies posted  3 replies      Number of times viewed  32 views      Add Reply
Author's photo

calexbraska created a topic in Nonqualified Deferred Compensation

How Do I Look Up a Top Hat Filing?

Someone in my office claims to have filed a top hat filing for our top hat plan, but she has no record of it. Is there someplace online I can go to look up the filing?
Number of replies posted  3 replies      Number of times viewed  52 views      Add Reply
Author's photo

msmith created a topic in 401(k) Plans

ADP Test and 'Otherwise Excludable'

New employer and new 401(k) plan for 2017. All NHCE's and HCE's are considered otherwise excludable. Testing software shows the ADP of the otherwise excludable NHCE's as "N/A" and the HCE's as 1.50%. The software says the plan has passed the ADP -- but it just doesn't look right to me. Comments?
Number of replies posted  2 replies      Number of times viewed  58 views      Add Reply
Author's photo

Fletch created a topic in Defined Benefit Plans, Including Cash Balance

Assumptions Used to Calculate Withdrawal Liability

Client asked for withdrawal liability estimates for a number of years preceding withdrawal from multi-employer pension plan. The plan used the same rate to calculate liabilities (including estimates of withdrawal liability) and minimum funding for years prior to withdrawal. Upon withdrawal, the discount rate used to calculate the liabilities was changed from 7% to the PBGC rate and the liability skyrocketed. The rate for funding purposes stayed at 7%. The plan has had similar funding ratios, etc. for several years and there are no obvious signs as to why such a large discount rate change is warranted. We would like to talk to an actuary experienced in calculating withdrawal liability who can assess the reasonableness of the assumptions employed. All references greatly appreciated!
Number of replies posted  1 reply      Number of times viewed  40 views      Add Reply
Author's photo

Griswold created a topic in Health Plans (Including ACA, COBRA, HIPAA)

Simultaneously Cover Employees Under Two Health Plans?

Any reason why you can't have employees of the same entity in two different fully insured health plans? I don't see why not, but can't seem to find any authority on this either way. Thanks.
Number of replies posted  2 replies      Number of times viewed  23 views      Add Reply
Author's photo

Belgarath created a topic in Retirement Plans in General

All Assets Sold to Purchasers Who Want New EIN; What Effect on Retirement Plan?

Corporation A and Corporation B are a controlled group. "A" is the sponsor of a plan, and "B" is a Participating Employer. For purposes of this question, let us assume that "A has an EIN of "1" and "B has an EIN of "2." We just found out that someone purchased "A" several months ago, SUPPOSEDLY in an asset purchase. The information is a bit sketchy at this point, because the new owners of the assets of "A" apparently will keep the same business name but change the EIN to another number. Is that possible? In other words, can I purchase the assets of "A" and those "assets" include the right to continue doing business under the same name, but just under another (new) EIN? If so, then it appears that "A" and "B" are now, in fact, still a controlled group, as "A" still exists under EIN #1 and the ownership technically hasn't really changed. And that the asset purchase/issue of new EIN creates a new entity, "C" which must now choose either to adopt the assets and liabilities of the former "A" plan, or establish an entirely new plan. I'm finding this very confusing when determining how to handle the plan issues. All of the employees of "A" are now part of "C" if in fact there is a new entity "C." Whether "C" will continue with a plan is unknown. But "B" wants to continue to sponsor the plan as is, with no involvement with "A" or "C." This works fine if there is no controlled group, as if there isn't, it is just a Multiple Employer Plan at this time, and can withdraw or spinoff or whatever under normal procedures. I'd love to hear any thoughts on this.
Number of replies posted  6 replies      Number of times viewed  26 views      Add Reply, Inc.
1298 Minnesota Avenue, Suite H
Winter Park, Florida 32789
(407) 644-4146

Lois Baker, J.D., President
David Rhett Baker, J.D., Editor and Publisher
Holly Horton, Business Manager

Copyright 2018, Inc. All materials contained in this mailing are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of, Inc., or in the case of third party materials, the owner of those materials. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notices from copies of the content.

Links to web sites other than and are offered as a service to our readers; we were not involved in their production and are not responsible for their content.

Unsubscribe | Privacy Policy