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just in case there are some newbies out there who missed this awful joke. I made the rest of the bunch suffer through it, so you might as well. Besides, it has been a number of years since I posted this. .............................................................................................. The original Titanic -- the largest ship of its type at the time -- sank 100 years ago when it struck an iceberg on the night of April 15, 1912, on its maiden voyage from Southampton to New York. More than 1,500 people perished in the disaster, which captured the popular imagination. The ship had been vaunted as "unsinkable." Most people don't know that back in 1912, Hellmann's mayonnaise was manufactured in England. In fact, the Titanic was carrying 12,000 jars of the condiment scheduled for delivery in Vera Cruz, Mexico. This was to be the next port of call for the great ship after its stop in New York. This would have been the largest single shipment of mayonnaise ever delivered to Mexico. But as we know, the great ship did not make it to New York. The ship hit an iceberg and sank, and the cargo was forever lost. The people of Mexico, who were crazy about mayonnaise, and were eagerly awaiting its delivery, were disconsolate at the loss. Their anguish was so great, that they declared a National Day of Mourning, which they still observe to this day. The National Day of Mourning occurs each year on May 5th, the day the shipment was to arrive in Vera Cruz, and is known, of course, as Sinko de Mayo.

I agree with Ms. Jensen. You see prime + 1% all the time and I know of no case or FSA or anything else that has ever challenged. Prime without 1% is what a bank in theory would use for its most credit-worthy customers. Given the relative security of a loan secured by the participant's own account balance and the low costs of foreclosure, how is the participant not a prime risk? Arguably, holding the rate steady for a quarter is more questionable if interest rates volatile to high side. Maybe say it's held steady for quarter, but subject to change if the plan administrator determines sufficient movement in interest rates to warrant.

Well, that's a good point. The Code does say "any" plan covering employees of such person or any other member of such group... I was going to get Thai food for supper, but perhaps I'll try a little crow instead.

now now, just because the I in IRS stands for illogic (at least at times in regards to pensions)doesn't mean you can't use it....

I think when you pay online you have to put the date it was filed in EFAST. I believe it is triggered off the filing date which may be less than small plan or large plan filing fee if less than a certain number of days. I always either file on behalf of the client or have them file electronically same day as payment.