david rigby

Any chance that these HCE's are still within 60 days of distribution?

How about this site? IMHO, BenefitsLink.com is a first-resource. Search the entire site, or just the Message Boards, for articles or information on your specific item(s).

... Third, consider having the plan make a distribution (a "closeout") in the form of a direct rollover to an IRA. See IRS Publication 575: http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p575.pdf

Start reading on page 8 of this IRS publication: http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p575.pdf BTW, you can order your own copy by calling 1-800-TAXFORM

Are you sure the lump sum does not already have an interest adjustment included?

What did the insurance company say when you asked them these questions?

Data as of 30-MAY-08 Moody's Daily Long-term Corporate Bond Yield Averages Utilities Industrial Corporate Aaa NA 5.67 5.67 Aa 6.18 6.07 6.13 A 6.36 6.46 6.41 Baa 6.93 7.18 7.06 Avg 6.49 6.35 6.42 Moody's Daily Treasury Yield Averages Short-Term (3-5 yrs) 3.04 Medium-Term (5-10 yrs) 3.76 Long-Term (10+ yrs) 4.59

Speaking of "down this road before": http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=36434 http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=28518 http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=26763 http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=19745 http://benefitslink.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=11880

I disagree, if "within a year" means 12 months. If this means "during the plan year of termination", then the statement is better (maybe not perfect, but better).

Is that a question, or a statement?

... but you cannot exclude NHCEs based on criteria that would fail other tests, such as "exclude all males".

Is that (or any) PBGC rule relevant for the plan described in original post?

A stamp is an inexpensive investment. Write the letter.

Is a DL is the key to getting/documenting a valid rollover? If so, then going thru this "hassle" might be worthwhile? If not, then it may be overkill. Since I'm not a lawyer, my default recommendation is to do the DL.

I assume you are discussing a DB plan. But no matter. If you have any doubt, just report all the VTs. Also, report any lump sum payments (using "D") even if you think they may have been reported before.

Are you under the impression that the making of law, and/or the law itself, is logical?

Perhaps I misunderstand the question. Is masteff's response implying that the proposed change affects only some people who are not yet participnats, and (therefore) cannot be construed as a "cutback"? If so, that may not be the relevant test. Relevant is what impact applies to those who are already participants. Could the change reduce the proportion of the PS allocation received by current participants? and does it matter if they have not yet earned any right to the 2008 PS?

IRC 411(e): Perhaps my interpretation is flawed, but I interpret 411(e) as saying a govt. plan is exempt from all of IRC 411, if it complies with 401(a)(4) and 401(a)(7) as in effect immediately prior to ERISA. Neither of those pre-ERISA sections contain anything like the language in current 411(d)(6).

To the best of my recollection, govt. plans are specifically exempt from all of IRC section 411. But I'll have to reread it tomorrow morning back at the office. State laws would likely apply in the case of the WV plan.

Huh?

IRM is here: http://www.irs.gov/irm/index.html No luck with the TAM. (BNA goes back to only 1999.)

Not an answer to your question, but have you considered, and does the plan permit, settling all plan obligations via group annuity purchase? I'm not saying it is cheaper than 417e lump sums, just that there is no harm in checking.

The relationship of the original poster to the plan/sponsor is unclear. If not legal counsel, I suggest two things: - read interesting comments above, and - get thee (plan administrator) to a competent ERISA counsel.

Sounds like an opportunity to improve the plan's definition of "termination". Decide/negotiate what is desired, and put it in the document.

It may also be nice to see improved grammar and/or punctuation. But most plans struggle with that.