TheBoxMan
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Missing participant with fake Social Security Number
TheBoxMan replied to pixiebear's topic in Plan Terminations
Yes, I can see some wiggle room there if there is no amendment to terminate. I would recommend caution if this is not something the plan does as part of their normal plan administration. If the plan does a small sum cash out every year and this participant didn't get cashed out because of the SSN issue, then I would say the plan could proceed with the IRA if that is part of the plan document. However, if the plan does not cash out small sums every year and decides during the "trying to terminate" time to investigate and make distributions to this population, PBGC will likely consider any distributions made during this time as an attempt to avoid PBGC plan termination regulations and all of these distribution will be subject to PBGC audit. -
Missing participant with fake Social Security Number
TheBoxMan replied to pixiebear's topic in Plan Terminations
If this is a qualified plan covered by PBGC...you cannot roll over to an IRA! If the plan is terminating, all missing participants need to be reported and the benefit sent to the PBGC Missing Participant Program. -
Overfunded DB Plan
TheBoxMan replied to sobrienTPS's topic in Defined Benefit Plans, Including Cash Balance
I agree with Tom. Even with a favorable IRS determination letter, if this is discovered during a PBGC audit, the plan will be on the hook to pay the excess assets as described in the plan document.- 14 replies
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The timing is not clear in the question. Were the IRA rollovers done prior to the execution of a termination amendment? Was it done as part of the regular course of plan administration (provision in plan document and the plan does this every year with cash outs that they cannot locate)? If so, then the IRA is fine for these 6. But, if this is a qualified pension plan and the plan was already in the process of terminating, then the funds cannot be rolled into an IRA for the missing participants. The plan must purchase annuities or send the money to the PBGC under the Missing Participant Plan rules.
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lump sum payouts after bankruptcy filing
TheBoxMan replied to erisageek1978's topic in Plan Terminations
I may be misinterpreting the question. But, if the plan is doing a "standard termination" of a qualified defined benefit plan...the plan needs to be fully funded to pay all of the benefits owed. There is no option to say "we don't have enough money to pay the lump sums" in a standard termination. -
I think that pro rata to CB account balances or pro rata to accrued monthly benefits would both be non-discriminatory. The point I was trying to make is...don't amend the plan document to state that the plan will reallocate excess assets. You stated, "The document allows for reallocation...". Does it allow it or require it? That is a huge difference.
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Plan termination distributions done incorrectly
TheBoxMan replied to Jakyasar's topic in Retirement Plans in General
Hypothetically, since I would never try to advise anyone about a potential legal issue...I think the simple correction is to have the plan ask the 10 participants, who originally wanted a lump sum, to complete new pension election forms showing they elected a rollover to the 401(k). That would make everything match for record-keeping purposes in the event of an audit. -
Force out amount upon plan termination
TheBoxMan replied to Jakyasar's topic in Retirement Plans in General
Paul I, that is out of date. The PBGC does not allow for rollovers to an IRA for non-responsive participants. The plan would need to use the PBGC Missing Participant Program. -
DB Plan Mandatory Cashouts
TheBoxMan replied to Hojo's topic in Defined Benefit Plans, Including Cash Balance
If the plan document allows the forced rollover and it is before the termination "process" than it should be fine. Meaning that all of this should be done before the date of the execution of the Termination Amendment. -
Putting the issue of "nondiscriminatory" to the side...excess assets can be distributed to the participants, even if the plan document states that excess assets revert to the employer. For a plan termination with the PBGC, if you are audited, the PBGC will only calculate the normal accrued benefit, if reversion is allowed. If reversion is not allowed, the PBGC will calculate the normal accrued benefit and the excess assets calculation. You don't need to amend the plan document to state excess assets will be paid at termination. By amending the plan document to pay the excess assets, you just open the plan up to additional review from the PBGC.
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Back in 2001, it was common for plans to have automatic rollovers to an IRA for benefits between $1,000 and $5,000. I would check to see if the money was put in an IRA for you. The Summary Plan Description or Plan Document from back then should state the automatic rollover provision, but they usually don't specify the exact IRA company. It was common for the automatic rollovers to be with the same company as the 401)k) plan. So, if your prior employer had Fidelity as the 401(k) vendor, they could have rolled it over to an IRA with Fidelity. Good Luck!
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Was this a plan covered by the PBGC? If so, this plan was not correctly terminated. A plan cannot rollover the benefit for non-responsive participants to an IRA. For terminations post-2018, participants who do not respond are considered missing. Pursuant to 29 C.F.R. § 4050.103(a), the plan must provide for a missing distributee's plan benefit by filing with the PBGC Missing Participant program and either purchase an irrevocable commitment from a private insurer or transfer the value of the distributee's benefit to the PBGC Missing Participant program. If this plan termination is audited by PBGC, they will make the plan purchase annuities for these participants or transfer the money to the PBGC Missing Participant program. Even if plans purchase annuity certificates for missing participants, they still need to report those missing participants to the PBGC.
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I didn't see anything that explained how the plan document defined Early Retirement. "Missing plan documents" are not an excuse for bad pension administration. Also, I don't think PBGC protection has ended yet, as the PBGC can audit this plan termination. If the Group Annuity Contract provisions do not match the plan document provisions, the plan will have to correct this and amend the Group Annuity Contract.
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I may have exaggerated slightly, in that a doctor's office pays 4 or 5 doctors a couple million and the rest of the participants a few thousand each. Top heavy plan, covered in a profit sharing plan. Still just a way to pay tax deferred profits to the owners of the business.
