Young Curmudgeon Posted July 22, 2008 Posted July 22, 2008 My plan already offers a 50% & 100% J&S option for which we have printed tables. J&S 50 is the normal form. My problem is that the records are so old, nobody seems to know where the tables originated. They don't match any standard tables so it seems long ago an in-house actuary developed them. Rather than spend a pile of money to have someone recreate, can I just amend the normal form to J&S 100 and leave things as they are?
Andy the Actuary Posted July 22, 2008 Posted July 22, 2008 Assumption is that the standard form is a life annuity so it is assumed that by normal form you mean an actuarial equivalent J&S. In such case, your approach seems reasonable. Any bias in the tables would come out in the relative values. In any event, you could only get rid of the tables on a wear-away basis so they'd still be around. The material provided and the opinions expressed in this post are for general informational purposes only and should not be used or relied upon as the basis for any action or inaction. You should obtain appropriate tax, legal, or other professional advice.
Blinky the 3-eyed Fish Posted July 22, 2008 Posted July 22, 2008 How will changing the normal form to J&100%S help you since the QOSA has to be actuarially equivalent to the SLA? "What's in the big salad?" "Big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs."
Young Curmudgeon Posted July 23, 2008 Author Posted July 23, 2008 My understanding is that if the QJSA options are the actuarial equivalent of the SLA and the 100% form is the normal form of benefit, if you already offer the 50% option, you don't need to add anything. Is the incorrect?
Blinky the 3-eyed Fish Posted July 23, 2008 Posted July 23, 2008 That is correct. I think I understand your issue now. You were going to be unable to produce an actuarially equivalent J&75% option because you had no table to make the conversion but you can produce it for the J&50% option. Do you not have stated actuarial equivalent interest and mortality in the plan document but rather some set of conversion tables? "What's in the big salad?" "Big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs."
Young Curmudgeon Posted July 23, 2008 Author Posted July 23, 2008 Only the paper tables, which appear to be more favorable than SLA equivalent.
ak2ary Posted July 23, 2008 Posted July 23, 2008 The formula to convert a J&50%S reduction factor to a J&75%S reduction factor is: S = 2 x F / (3 - F) Where S is the Joint and 75% Survivor reduction factor and F is the J&50%S reduction factor. This will allow you to convert a tabular factor from J&50 to j&75 without having the underlying tables...so you can reconstruct a J&75 table Check it out where you know the factors...
Blinky the 3-eyed Fish Posted July 23, 2008 Posted July 23, 2008 Nifty formula. They didn't teach me that one at actuary school. "What's in the big salad?" "Big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs."
ak2ary Posted July 23, 2008 Posted July 23, 2008 I am sure it came from some actuary skool...but not the one I went to either. When discussing precisely this issue earlier this year and how to deal with it, one of my partners said, "why dont we just use the two times F formula?" The rest of the room looked at him like he had three heads, but he wrote the formula on a white board (without referencing any books) and we tested it against about 20 combinations of interest rates and mortality tables and it worked. Since then another actuary in my office has proven it works by deriving it from commutation functions
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