TPAJake

I think some clarification may be in order--I read this as Participant DID receive hardship even though he shouldn't have, then is coming back with a complaint to the PA for not denying it. In any case, I can't see the Participant getting any traction with this. PA should revise procedures though.

This is timely, issued the 26th: https://www.irs.gov/pub/foia/ig/spder/tege-04-0717-0020.pdf

How are we reconciling these 2 underlined statements? You say the negotiations would not include this Plan, but what happens when one day you get a signed CBA in the mail & all of a sudden they DID negotiate on this Plan? That's just 1 of many issues I see happening with this Plan in the first few years. They are already covered under a union Plan as well, so how much value can another Plan provide?

The only thing I see you're missing is profitability. Call me a coward, but I would run from this "prospect" as quickly as possible. No way they are going to be willing to pay enough to make this worthwhile.

I don't think that is the method I would recommend for such a situation...

I have never run across chapter & verse on this, but I will echo that my clients are encouraged to reallocate any excess annually. If that hasn't been done in a few years I would pay out any expenses that are due (or about to be due) & run an allocation. I can't imagine needing to file on it, but again I haven't been in this exact scenario

I have a client with a Plan Document written by their Attorney--Operated since 1985 without a written loan policy. Asked the Attorney office for a copy so we know the terms of the loans....Nothing but silence in return

Not likely. In my experience they find out that the provisions don't match their intentions when it comes time to write a check. Or they get a refund...

WCC seems to have answered most of your questions & you have a very generous Employer-Sponsored plan which you are taking advantage of--Good for you! Find a good Certified Financial Planner (CFP) who can do all the rest for you. Sounds like you're on the right track!

I had a boss once that asked me to re-print an old DB freeze that was never executed so the client could sign it now & submit to PBGC during a plan termination. I refused of course & immediately started job hunting. I won't be party to that kind of garbage.

Our clients never read it either & the AA starts with a one page executive summary that basically says "we wrote this for you, now give the employees this other thing called an SPD". BPD is 108 pages, SPD is 21 pages & AA is 44 pages. If they have a loan policy, that's an additional 3 pages.

Most are represented by an existing Financial Advisor/broker & that firm would lead the process. In cases where the FA is on the chopping block too, I've seen Mercer & Buck take this role, as mentioned above

As ESOP guy indicated, the hardest part would be finding a consultant without a conflict of interest, but broad enough knowledge to do the job. If you do find that person, they are bound to be expensive since there is no recurring revenue to be had. Plans of that size are a bit outside my expertise, so I'm not sure how prevalent it is to have a independent consultant lead the RFP, but it seems like a wise investment given the current rash of 401k litigation. Should be pretty easy to show your 401k committee members the stats on how many cases are in courts at the moment.

Seriously, tell him to go fly a kite--That's not how qualified plans work

Good question, maybe ask over in the HSA forum as well to ensure you get a complete answer.

And they are exempt from the encore if they roll-in their old 401k...I can do this all day!

Tell them you'll stop singing if they all defer at least 6%. Your client will say thank you for scarring the Employees' collective psyche to such an extent as to never risk failing ADP ever again--Money & time well spent! "Enroll in the 401k or else the HR team will bring that goofy singing CPA back in here"

Any time I get a question like this from a client, I immediately chuckle (loud enough they can hear me), say NONONO, then bluntly ask them if they think that passes the smell test. I mean come on, they knew the answer before they asked. Anything you give them in writing has an equal chance of being self-protection for you or ammunition for them, so stick to regs & published guidance if you give them anything at all...I wouldn't.

A 73 year old in poor health is planning a wedding? There's all the red flags you need right there

Good luck with that--The type of Sponsor that causes these issues is the root of the problem. Then history will repeat next time they have some super special new exec to recruit. Chapter 3 of that book is them blaming you for the whole mess

The non-spouse form sounds like a winner, no?

Sorry Austin, I don't have access to a generic form--Doesn't the recordkeeper have one? Their form will need to be filled out somewhere along the way I'm sure

Exactly. You have to be careful with those compensation definitions too--Most of those Employees will be heavy on the tips for comp & excluding tips is likely discriminatory. If you include the tips as comp, how do you accurately apply deferral elections? Restaurant plans are no fun

Unfortunately, I have seen this movie & it does not have a happy ending. I can't speak to a resolution, but I agree with your assessment of their improper & less-than ethical practices of furnishing that letter

I've processed plenty of hardships prior to closing, never have I reimbursed after closing