Paul I
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Paul I last won the day on January 12
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CuseFan is correct in pointing out that the 80/120 is used for determining whether the plan must file a 5500 versus a 5500-SF. BPF916, the 1-100 participants for the start-up credit really is not black and white. The count is based on the employer: having 100 or fewer employees (not participants) who had compensation of at least $5,000 (regardless of plan eligibility) in the preceding year (subject to an available election to have the first credit year be the year preceding the year containing the effective date of the plan) There also is a 2 Year Grace Period where the employer is considered eligible for the credit for the 2 years following the last year the employer was eligible. Check out all of the eligibility criteria because there are certain conditions that will disqualify an employer from taking the credit such as the employer was involved with a merger, or there are related companies with existing plans, or if the employer had a plan in the 3 years prior to the new plan. None of this has to do with the 80/120 rule.
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New Career Path into Retirement Plans
Paul I replied to HarleyBabe's topic in Retirement Plans in General
Going fully remote with no experience in the field likely will be next to impossible. Consider a strategy that demonstrates a strong work ethic and commitment to learning the business along with establishing some personal contacts with people in the business. Pursuing starting to build professional credentials by enrolling in courses available from industry groups/associations like ASPPA. A QKA (Qualified 401K Administrator) would be a great start, as would a RPF Certificate (Retirement Plan Fundamentals). There are many different types of firms that work with retirement plans - third party administrators, recordkeepers, financial advisors, accountants, banks/brokerage houses... - so explore opportunities with any of these firms that are close enough for starting out with a hybrid approach. Look for professional associations that hold periodic, in-person events. They provide opportunities to connect face-to-face with industry professionals. There also are some mentoring opportunities such as the Thrive Mentoring Program. You can find additional here: https://www.usaretirement.org/get-involved/special-initiatives/thrive-mentoring-program/ It will be a challenge, but the professionals in the retirement plan industry welcome anyone who is committed to working in the field. Best of luck to your daughter! -
Will recordkeepers be ready to process the saver’s match?
Paul I replied to Peter Gulia's topic in 401(k) Plans
Peter, you are not overlooking anything. Plans are designed to gather information beforehand about participants and money coming into the plan. This is not built into the Saver's Match design. There is a significant mismatch between how retirement plans are administered and how tax "refunds" (read money paid from the Treasury to an individual) are administered. The simplest way to characterize a recordkeeper taking on administering Saver's Match account is trying to pound a square peg into a round hole. The SPARK comment letter's great detail about the mechanics of moving the money around is just one example of the issues a recordkeeper will face. -
Contributions and matching after 401(a)(17) limit has been reached?
Paul I replied to MD-Benefits Guy's topic in 401(k) Plans
Permissible if Pam works long enough to receive 7 paychecks during the year. The comp limit for 2026 is $360,000. Her maximum match is the lesser of 7% * 360,000 = $25,200 (calculated based on the plan match provisions) or 100% of deferrals = $24,500 (calculated based on plan deferral limit), so her maximum match is $24,500. Her maximum match limit is reached when her YTD compensation reaches 7% of $350,000 = $24,500. If she terminates before having earned $350,000 for the year, she will have an excess match that will have to be taken away with earnings (either at the earlier of a distribution or the end of the plan year). Note that Pam would not necessarily have to work 7 consecutive paychecks to get the maximum match. Note further that the plan should not have explicit provisions that apply the match formula strictly on a time period that is less than a full year. These issues would be avoided if the compensation in the match formula was not to exceed YTD compensation versus using the 401(a)(17) limit, and the plan has a true-up. Granted, this caps the match each pay period at a lower amount, but Pam quickly gets up to the max. -
Will recordkeepers be ready to process the saver’s match?
Paul I replied to Peter Gulia's topic in 401(k) Plans
First, the Saver's Match has to survive 2026. The topic will start to gather attention based on the mandate for Treasury to report about it to Congress by July. The target recipients of the Saver's Match low- and moderate-income employees, replacing the pre-existing Savers’ Credit for low- and moderate-income employees who make contributions to retirement plans. There are elements rile up anti-DEI advocates such as the multilingual communications, and some analysis published in PlanSponsor magazine that concluded "Plan sponsors and participants both benefit from retirement plans implementing the Saver’s Match because adding it could reduce gender and race disparities in 401(k) balances, finds research from the Collaborative for Equitable Retirement Savings." IRS Notice 2024-65 says: "Section 104 of the SECURE 2.0 Act requires the Treasury Department to take steps to increase public awareness of Saver’s Match contributions, and to provide a report to Congress no later than July 1, 2026, summarizing the anticipated promotional efforts. The report must include a description of plans for: (1) the development and distribution of digital and print materials, including the distribution of such materials to states for participants in state facilitated retirement savings programs; (2) the translation of such materials into the 10 most commonly spoken languages in the United States after English ..." Assuming is does survive, a few recordkeepers at best will offer to receive and separately account for the match, and administer the more restrictive withdrawal provisions. No recordkeeper has access to the information needed to calculate the match or determine if the match calculation is accurate. Since retirement plans are not required to accept Saver's Match contributions and since IRAs can accept the Saver's Match, it is very likely that most plan recordkeepers will not accept it and refer clients to direct employees to IRAs. It is possible that some state-run plans built around IRAs would be more interested in pursuing this. -
Contributions and matching after 401(a)(17) limit has been reached?
Paul I replied to MD-Benefits Guy's topic in 401(k) Plans
This issue has hung around since ERISA. The never has been a clarification in regulations or other formal guidance. It was included in a Q&A with the IRS that the IRS again addressed from the podium. Here was the question and response: "59. In a 401(k) plan, does 401(a)(17) preclude the following: A. A earns $300,000 annually. He enrolls in 401(k) calendar year plan in August, after earning $175,000. He defers $10,000 in the balance of the year. B. A earns $300,000 annually. He participates in a calendar year 401(k) plan making monthly deferrals of a flat dollar amount of 1/12 of $10,000 in 1998, even though his pay exceeded $160,000 before he was done making elective deferrals. C. Same as 2, but deferrals are a percentage of pay (3.33333%). We believe that all three scenarios should be ok. This will be discussed additionally from the podium." That's all of the formal guidance, folks! That having been said over a quarter century ago, and after the many, many plans that apply the limits on an annual basis have reviewed by the IRS and not found to be deficient, @401kology it is fair to say you understand correctly. A plan would (and could) have a provision that stops deferrals and match once a participant has YTD compensation that reaches the 401(a)(17) limit, but why would anyone except an uninformed payroll processor think this is a good idea? -
@OrderOfOps suggested steps are consistent with the IRS position that, for purposes of determining the year a distribution is taxable, a distribution occurs when the check is written and not when a check is cashed (and likely @ESOP Guy also had this in mind). The IRS took this position what asked about the year of taxation when a participant delayed cashing a check beyond plan year end. If this concept is applicable here, then the check represents an asset in the deceased participant's estate and would be dealt with consistently as any other assets in the estate. Mechanically, the check would be treated similar to checks that age out if not cashed timely.
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Check as many boxes as needed to cover however the tests were done. EFAST2 checks to see if nothing is checked and has an edit that issues a Warning, but not an Error. There is no edit for checking multiple boxes.
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Assuming (always risky) that the plan in question applies its defined Break In Service (<1000 hours) anywhere where breaks in service are used (determining years of service for eligibility, or vesting, or benefit accrual), then I agree the answer is No. Breaks in service using hours for these purposes are based on no more than 500 hours (or a lower number if an alternative method of calculating hours of service is used). Let's also keep in mind the a plan does not have to use break in service rules (i.e., a Break in Service is 0 hours.) If the plan defined the term Break in Service (<1000 hours) and used it solely in place of some other provisions (like eligibility for an allocation), then this is very poor and misleading plan drafting - essentially replacing a widely understood term of art with a narrowly applicable alternative definition.
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Look in Revenue Ruling 2007-43 regarding partial plan terminations and you will find this language: "If a partial termination occurs on account of turnover during an applicable period, all participating employees who had a severance from employment during the period must be fully vested in their accrued benefits, to the extent funded on that date, or in the amounts credited to their accounts." Based on this language, if a not-fully-vested employee was terminated as result of a partial plan termination, the employee would be considered 100% vested in their accrued benefit at that time. If this former employee subsequently is rehired, then their vesting percentage in any new accrued benefits would be determined using the vesting crediting rules of the plan document. The full vesting due to the partial plan termination does extend to or supersede the plan's vesting rules applicable to the new accrued benefits. I have not seen anything that support grandfather the full vesting due to the partial plan termination.
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Ask the questions @Peter Gulia provided above to assess whether there is an issue. Focusing on the recordkeeper's service agreement or mutually agreed-upon administrative procedures, keep in mind that the processing date (validations, control totals, compliance checks, available investment elections, ...) are data activities that precede the actual crediting payroll to participant accounts. The segregation of the payroll dollars (funding) from the control of the employer is the actual funding date (which is looked at by the DOL to determine if something there are late deposits). Typically for many plans, the movement of payroll dollars is an overnight process. An aggressive interpretation of when the actual funding occurs would be to say it happens on the date of the instruction of the transfer of funds to the recordkeeper. Another possible interpretation is the date the funds leave the control of the employer. Another possible interpretation is the date the funds arrive at the recordkeeper. A very conservative interpretation is the date the funds are invested. Smaller recordkeepers do not have the financial resources to front any funds to their clients. Major recordkeepers may make funds to be available for investment on the payroll date (or date payroll is approved for investing), and the recordkeepers coordinate the date of investment with the date of receipt of funds from the client. Theoretically, this is near perfect coordination of activities. In reality, stuff happens, and the timing goes off the track. As long as this is not a recurring pattern or a purposeful manipulation of funds, it does not seem to be a cause for concern for the regulators.
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Let's face it. A client complaining about giving the SHNEC to terminated employees more often than not is motivated by two things. The first is greed. The client likes the idea that they can maximize elective deferrals and think nondiscrimination tests are unfair to HCEs (and they abhor refunds). The second is the perception that terminated employees were not committed/loyal to the company and should not be "rewarded" with a 3% contribution (even though the SHNEC is very much akin to the employer funding payroll taxes). Sometimes the message has to be if the client wants the privilege of avoiding nondiscrimination testing (i.e., being able to maximize deferrals), the cost of that privilege is the 3% SHNEC. That being said, when a significant number employees do not defer, changing the plan design to a Safe Harbor Match often reduces the overall employer cost which seems to somewhat placate the client (until the employees catch on and start deferring more). Kudos to @Tom for trying to be responsive to his client and taking a wild shot.
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Technical Amendment Due To Mistake At Plan Setup
Paul I replied to metsfan026's topic in 401(k) Plans
From the way the OP is worded, it sounds as if the client does not want to assume any responsibility for signing a plan document without fully understanding what they were signing, and they now want to declare this is totally the TPAs fault. One thing that is almost always certain, when the IRS discovers a disconnect between the plan document and plan operations, the plan document governs and the plan sponsor is accountable for the content of the document. The only instances where the IRS possibly may be possibly swayed on a hope and a prayer is if there is an overwhelming amount of documentation contemporaneous with the adoption of the plan and the original intent to have certain provisions that were not reflected in the document. The IRS more likely be agreeable to accepting the retroactive application of plan provisions that are favorable to participants and are not discriminatory in operation. Given the changes in question, there should be no issue with accelerating the vesting schedule, but be careful with the change in NRA for any participant who is withing three years of age 62 (since attaining NRA would trigger full vesting). Be a little wary of this client who will blame you when something goes off the rails, and make sure you maintain documentation of source data and any operational issues when they arise. This is particularly important in this environment when plans can be administered base on documented administrative procedures that have not yet been codified into the formal plan document. -
We work with an outstanding service provider who services Southeastern Pennsylvania. If you are in this geographic ares, I can send you their contact information. Based on experience, I recommend in making your decision you consider the breadth and depth of a provider's technical support (in particular responsiveness), security (including availability of full encryption of all transmissions of email, data and storage), access to leading state-of-the-art technology, and cross-platform support (including computing, phone service, operating systems and hardware). The cost of these services almost always is higher than one would guess, but that often is because the outstanding providers provide more value for what most people don't even know they need. Consider documenting what services you will be providing to your clients over the next 2-3 months, and seeing if there is a way to deliver those services without compromising the integrity of clients' data, and be prepared to discuss with a successor provider strategies to get support through a transition period. In our business, we have an obligation to protect the information entrusted to us.
