Guest rickw Posted August 30, 2001 Posted August 30, 2001 Can anyone suggest a book or other resource to get a good basic understanding of cross-tested theory as well as some good case study/examples? We work with a lot of doctors in small groups and occasionally partnerships of PCs. We have done a number of "plain vanilla" ctp, but don't know enough to get more sophisticated/aggressive. We need to understand the capabilities of defining different classes to meet different HCE doctor's objectives (old, young, owner,non-owner). Thanks!
Guest Doug Goelz Posted August 30, 2001 Posted August 30, 2001 There was a booklet years ago from RIA entitled "A Complete Guide to Cross-Testing Defined Contribution Plans" that was written by Peter Christensen and Marjorie Martin. This would still give you a basis of the concepts. After that you would be best served to really study the 401(a)(4) and 410(B) regulations (including the recent law changes) and then review some of the past session notes prepared by speakers on the subject at prior EA and ASPA conferences.
Guest rickw Posted August 30, 2001 Posted August 30, 2001 Doug: Thanks for the suggestions. I checked with RIA and they either do not recognize or no longer have the item you suggested. Could it be that the item was from a different source?
Guest sdolce Posted August 30, 2001 Posted August 30, 2001 Here are two excellent references: The Coverage and Nondiscrimination Handbook by Amy Cavanaugh ,Panel Publishers, 800-234-1660, The ERISA Outline Book by Sal Tripodi,TRI Pension Services,303-470-7964. Good Luck.
stephen Posted August 30, 2001 Posted August 30, 2001 By the way I think Tom Poje, a frequent message board answerer, is a co-author on the Coverage and Non-discrimination book.
AndyH Posted August 31, 2001 Posted August 31, 2001 I didn't realize that, but I did notice from the ASPA conference agenda that Tom is doing a session at the ASPA national conference this October. Congratulations to Tom for his well-deserved recognition.
Tom Poje Posted August 31, 2001 Posted August 31, 2001 a bit humbled at this end! The Panel Publisher Book came about in an interesting way. Every once and a while my boss 'rents' me out for a combination software/pension training. (Actually, they can't stand me here, so they get me out of the office when they can) Anyway, this one time it was at the company Amy Cavanaugh was working for, and I noticed a copy of the nondiscrim book on the shelf. Of course, I was fascinated, and 'stupid' enough to indicate so Amy asked me to review the first edition, etc., and so I ended up on the second edition. and yes, I am scheduled to give one of the talks at the ASPA conference at the end of October. The talk is intended to be more on the basic / intermediate level, so it doesn't get heavy into cross testing issues such as 'is this company a good choice for cross testing, and why/why not'. It is more on the level of coverage, participation, amounts testing, brf issues, etc. rather than a finely detailed cross testing presentation. thanks again for the friendly comments!
Fred Payne Posted August 31, 2001 Posted August 31, 2001 I've previously gone through Tripodi's ERISA Outline Book and I think it does a great job on some of the basics of calculating EBARs, but there is not much information on cross-testing with 401k's involved--particularly if imputing disaprity. I'm certain there's no examples of calculations involving cross-testing 401ks. Maybe Tom can answer this best, but does Amy's book, The Coverage and Nondiscrimination Handbook, include examples of how to undertake the cross-tested calculations with 401ks? Does it cover the disparity issue well?
Tom Poje Posted August 31, 2001 Posted August 31, 2001 I have not seen the second edition yet. (certainly the first book didn't) I sent a bunch of stuff to Amy in regards to this. one of my suggestions was for some examples in the appendix, which would have included disparity calc - I don't know it they made it in.
Guest acavanaughcpc Posted September 6, 2001 Posted September 6, 2001 they are in but not as many as could be-new addition in the spring if you can wait that long
Guest pdaniels Posted September 9, 2001 Posted September 9, 2001 Tom is incorrect when he says that we want to get him out of the office - as I am sure you all can imagine, if you have ever met the Pojeman, you know he is quite liked by all. And we all feel very luck to have him here - otherwise we wouldn't have anyone to pick on.
Guest M.N. Ouellette Posted October 3, 2001 Posted October 3, 2001 Hi Rick. We use Datair software, which has been immensely helpful. We are a small TPA firm and 90% of our clients are small doctor's groups. We love New Comparability plans, but they either work really well, or not at all! Doctors do have a special situation in that they are such high earners, and typically have young employees. New Comp works nicely a lot of times, but with the Gateway requirements, it might be more difficult to so easily get the doc's their max contribution. Good luck!
Guest Tom Geer Posted October 17, 2001 Posted October 17, 2001 BNA has an entire Tax Management Portfolio on hybrid/specialized plan designs. It's not a "primer, but it's very good.
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