IRS Submission

[Blinky the 3-eyed Fish]

I have often submitted amendments as proposed, i.e. unsigned but will be signed after IRS approval, with no problems. However, I attempted to submit the initial qualification of a plan as proposed, again meaning the plan would be adopted after IRS approval. It was unfortunately rejected by the agent. Anyone ever try this with success or know of a cite that spells out why this is not possible?

The whole idea is for the client not to sign (and be locked into) something the IRS will not approve of, which could then cause some nastyness to spew onto me.

No Andy, it is not a 412(i) plan.

[mbozek]

How about the instructions for the 5300 form line 3a- enter 9/9/9999 for date plan was signed if plan is submitted in proposed form. The agent may be of the opinion that a plan is not in effect until it is adopted; therfore a proposed plan cannot be submitted for approval. See Rev Rul 81-114.

I agree with RB- All of my plans are adopted by the employer subject to receipt of a favorable determination. If the IRS refuses to approve the plan it is never established.

I have a Q- What if the IRS does not approve the plan by the end of the employer's tax year? Is the plan adopted for that yr if signed in a later yr?

[R. Butler]

Never tried what you suggest. The plans for which we have sent in filings have all contained the boiler plate language that the plan is void if the IRS determines its not qualified. We explain thta provision to the client from the outset just so they are aware of the possibility.

[E as in ERISA]

Are the amendments retroactive or prospective?

[Guest hyper]

I agree, add boilerplate that plan void if no FDL issued. I assume pre-tax deferrals are not being permitted before the plan has been adopted.

[Guest SuzanneW]

You don't have a plan until it is adopted. Until that point, it is just a theory or concept, and the IRS will not make a determination on a theory or concept. What if they approve it, and then the client decides not to adopt it. Instructions to 5300 and 5307 both use the term "plan", and I am sure the agent was just trying to convey that you need a "plan", not a "proposed plan".