412(i) plan document review

[John Feldt ERPA CPC QPA]

Our firm is not involved with 412(i) plans, but we were asked if we knew anyone who could review a 412(i) plan document.

If you know of any 412(i) plan document attorneys, please let me know.

-Thanks!

[Blinky the 3-eyed Fish]

I know of a guy but I am not sure where is office/van is parked right now.

[AndyH]

I know of a guy but I am not sure where is office/van is parked right now.

In the yacht club parking lot silly.

[JAY21]

I don't have an attorney name for you though a general comment is that I'm not sure there is much to review, at least not much different than a traditional DB plan doc other than no Trust Section, instead states the contributions will be exclusively invested in insurance products, and then the accrued benefit section states the AB will be equal to the benefits provided under the insurance contracts. That's really about it I believe, at least from the 412i docs I've seen. No, I'm not a 412i fan, just got stuck with a few.

[AndyH]

I've looked at only a couple of them.

One I looked at seemed ok to me. Then I learned later that there were several fatal flaws in it from the IRS' perspective. What I learned is that you need to completely understand the IRS' issues with these to be able to "review the document" competently.

John, I would engage an attorney who defends advocates of these to truly get an assessment. There are some who advertise here. There are also sellers of these things here who might be able to refer their attorney.

[John Feldt ERPA CPC QPA]

Thanks Jay21 and AndyH. Yeah, we're not touching these. I'll look through the advertisers and hopefully they list a cell phone number so I can reach their van.

[Peter Gulia]

If the prospective client has no ties to any insurance business and wants a candid assessment about whether a plan and insurance contracts followed IRC 412(i), or would square with PPA-revised IRC 412(e)(3), and avoided, or would avoid, anything that could trigger an unintended Federal income tax treatment, please feel free to call me.

[John Feldt ERPA CPC QPA]

Will do.

[Peanut Butter Man]

You should have someone review the plan who actually writes 412i plans AND has walked their 412i plan through the determination letter process with the IRS. This type of experience is needed before reviewing someone else's plan to see if there are any issues. It is one thing to read someone else's plan and it is an entirely different thing to read someone else's plan after surviving a few rounds with the IRS over a 412i plan.

[John Feldt ERPA CPC QPA]

Thanks, man. They will be so advised.