Guest GordonJ Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 I have a small Retirement plan that has 5 participants with a 2008 decretionary contribution of $62,000. Isn't this over the $46,000 415 limit? What are my options to get back to compliance? Can some contributions be considered for 2009?
david rigby Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 The 415 limit is per individual, not per plan. Is that what you mean? I'm a retirement actuary. Nothing about my comments is intended or should be construed as investment, tax, legal or accounting advice. Occasionally, but not all the time, it might be reasonable to interpret my comments as actuarial or consulting advice.
Guest GordonJ Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 The 415 limit is per individual, not per plan. Is that what you mean? Each Participant has $62,000.
WDIK Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 1) Are there other plan participants in addition to the five in question? 2) When were the contributions deposited into the trust? ...but then again, What Do I Know?
Guest GordonJ Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 1) Are there other plan participants in addition to the five in question?2) When were the contributions deposited into the trust? There is another participant. However he is retired. Contributions are deposited monthly during 2008. There was no accrued ER contrib on 12/31/08.
BG5150 Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Don't forget about the deductibility limit which caps the total PS at 25% of covered comp. So, in total, the covered compensation for 2008 can't be more than $1,240,000. QKA, QPA, CPC, ERPATwo wrongs don't make a right, but three rights make a left.
david rigby Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Assuming your refer to a DC plan (since you use the word "discretionary"), the 2008 limit under IRC 415© is/was $46,000. So, $62K each is a problem. But, if this is a DB plan, then the answer changes. I'm a retirement actuary. Nothing about my comments is intended or should be construed as investment, tax, legal or accounting advice. Occasionally, but not all the time, it might be reasonable to interpret my comments as actuarial or consulting advice.
Guest GordonJ Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Yes this is a DC plan. Can any of the contributions be considered for the year 2009 even though they were deposited in 2008? What are the options when over 415 limit? Thanks to anyone.
Jim Chad Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 The document might tell you to allocate to other Participants, if there are any. If there are no other Participants, then yes, it will be a 2009 contribution and there will be a penalty for a nondeductible contribution for 2008. I think it is 6%. Can anybody confirm or correct?
PensionPro Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Under Section 4972, the excise tax on nondeductible contributions to qualified employer plans is 10%. I seem to vaguely recall that there is an exception stating nondeductible contributions may be returned to the employer within a year. The references I have are Revenue Ruling 91-4 and ERISA Sec. 403©(2)©, but have not had an opportunity to look through the details. PensionPro, CPC, TGPC
Appleby Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 You may be thinking of when the IRS disallows the deduction, such as in a case where the plan document is not approved by the IRS ( plan adopted pending IRS approval of document) Life and Death Planning for Retirement Benefits by Natalie B. Choatehttps://www.ataxplan.com/life-and-death-planning-for-retirement-benefits/ www.DeniseAppleby.com
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