Two Plans / Two NRAs

Plan A and Plan B (profit sharing plans) are in a controlled group (ok, their respective employers are).  I am running rate group testing with cross-testing for both plans.

Plan A has an NRA of 62 and Plan B has an NRA of 65.  I can see in the regs (1.401(a)(4)-12) where the rule is that you use the latest NRA available (in this case 65) for testing, but the language of the reg seems to all speak in the context of one single plan.

Can somoene point me to the language that you would apply that definition in the way I have described when the testing is being performed at the controlled group level for 2 separate plans?

The definition of "Plan" in 1.401(a)(4)-12: Plan means a plan within the meaning of §1.410(b)-7 (a) and (b), after application of the mandatory disaggregation rules of §1.410(b)-7(c) and the permissive aggregation rules of §1.410(b)-7(d).

Once you have permissively aggregated the two plans for testing, they become a single "plan" with a single latest normal retirement age.

Aha -

I am not aggregating.  I do have to run one average benefits test though.  But otherwise I am testing each plan separately for coverage, and of course the rate group testing applies those coverage principles.  But I'm not aggregating. 

hmmm... I suppose aggregating or not I would get the same result.  I actually misspoke about one thing- one plan is just a 401k/match plan.  The other is the cross-tested plan.  But whether I "aggreagete" or not I guess I end up in the same place.  Agreed?

I thought the issue was what NRA to use?  If the plans aren't being aggregated for coverage then your coverage ebar's will be based on th NRA of the plan in question.  You are forced to aggregate for ABT purposes and you would then use the older for testing.

Makes sense!

I also found this in 1.410(b)-5   Average benefit percentage test.

(5) Determination of employee benefit percentage—(i) General rule. The employee benefit percentage for an employee for a testing period is the rate that would be determined for that employee for purposes of applying the general test for nondiscrimination in §§1.401(a)(4)-2, 1.401(a)(4)-3, 1.401(a)(4)-8 or 1.401(a)(4)-9, if all the plans in the testing group were aggregated for purposes of section 410(b).

Because they referenced "if all the plans in the testing group were aggregated" that suggests the permissive aggregation rule applies, and they are all one plan for purposes of determining the testing age.