GBurns

It really did not need insider information nor the ability to see the future. It was that Microsoft apparently either did not bother to read the law, do any research or just thought that they could get away with flaunting the law. There have been no law changes caused by Vizcaino or anything related to it. Thereby showing that it was Microsoft's interpretation at fault, whether they admit it or not. The people who had the wording before were only being correct in their interpretation and application of the applicable laws. They needed no insider info or fortune telling powers, just basic reading and comprehension skills. In fact it was not the IRS that started the whole issue, it was Vizcaino and other employees who saw that they were being mistreated etc and who sued. These simple employees saw the questionable treatment first not the IRS. They saw exactly the same thing that the employers who had the wording also saw.

So do I? But I guess that is expected. To all, Some of us just try to please. Some I wish would please try......

Can you give a link to this Memorandum?

"If you need an annuity and that is a big if ...." However do not get hung up on the commissions get hung up on the terms, conditions and return. Not every annuity feature is available in every product and not every feature is available in non commissioned products. Decide what you need then decide where you get it from and under what conditions etc. Do you restrict your car buying to Saturn only?

I guess it will depend on the details and what is in the fine print. Maybe recourse might be against the promoter rather than the company, and it is not clear which is which. Who were these contractors ICs to?

quint, I guess the old saying is true, Birds of a feather flock together. How about trying to contribute something of value every once in a while? What benefit do you get from spending time researching for my personal info?

The resolution of the Microsoft case came not directly through Vizcaino but through settling the misclassification with the IRS and DoL.

This is what I got for UP84 Mortality Table: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=UP84+...G=Google+Search

Forms R Us To whom is your post addressed?

You are right I really should read proxy statements. I did not realize how many such plans there were including ones such as Nextel's which lumps employees and non-employee directors together in 1 plan. However, I notice that an increasing number have frozen their plans in response to 409A. As the SEC site gets updated I expect to see many more doing so. I wonder if it has ever been put to the test, by the IRS, as to whether or not the Corp can be the plan sponsor for a non-employee and whether an IC can have someone else sponsor the plan of the non-employee. I would love to have someone sponsor a plan for me. By the way, Directors are not "considered independent contractors, or self-employed, for tax law purposes". They are considered so for ALL purposes whether it be Labor law, Workers Comp etc.

From what vebaguru says, it does not matter whether it is an ERISA trust or not, See his posts.

They also had to give retroactive benefits (stock etc etc) to many of those ICS who had to be reclassified.

What does it matter to mrjones? I do not do nor do I plan to do pension administration or anything that he plans to do. I have all I need for what I do, the people that I represent, and those that I represent them before.

This should give you a good explanation: http://www.complianceheadquarters.com/IRA/...es/1_14_05.html

This should help: http://www.complianceheadquarters.com/IRA/...es/1_14_05.html

You should find your answers within this: http://www.complianceheadquarters.com/IRA/...es/1_14_05.html

Harry O "Your theory would indeed be revolutionary and make every outside director at public companies throughout the U.S. drop their deferred fee plans! I'm not aware of any such plans paying a greater than 15.3% return!" makes no sense. mbozek referenced ICs, there should be no public companies having deferred comp for their ICs and there are no public companies that could drop their DC plan because of what ICs should have to earn to break even There is no relevance in this comment to what mbozek posted. How come you picked on mbozek's rational follow up to tompaul's analysis but did not criticize that analysis which is the basis for his comment? Aside from that your calculation is either questionable or badly illustrated, but I will leave that for now to see what others see.

Your title does not seem in keeping with the context of your post. Is the company moving from NASDAQ to pink slips? By pink slips do you mean OTC? Why do you regard pink slips as not being publicly traded? As for the questions, I would think that those situations have to be governed by the plan document etc.

Do you or your peers regard it as a professional designation?

Donkey Kong Don't you ever feel like contributing something of value to any discussion even once in a while? It seems that you only post short snide remarks.

What and who determines what is a professional designation?

Well said joeyd. It is nice to see you defend yourself without getting abusive which is something some of our posters have not yet learned to do. Do not take Blinky too seriously, he probably did not read your post very well, note the moniker plus it might have been chilly. But even if he had, it seems that his business owning or entrepreneurial experience might be lacking and so he would not understand. Let us know how you are progressing and seek some comments, even those that will have to taken with a grain of salt.

I think the instructions are in Pub 15 Circular E.

ING is part of 1 of the worlds largest financial services company of similar name. I think they are Dutch. You start by reading and understanding the details of what he told you. Not the sales hype but the contract fine print and required illustration. Get all answers to important questions in writing. You also need to better understand the terminology used. For example you stated that it was a 10 year investment. Did you mean that you have to keep making regular deposits for 10 years or did you mean that they imposed a 10 year surrender charge period? BIIIG difference. How much was the penalty? How does his proposal compare to other major companies? Do not buy anything that you do not understand. Check A.M Best, Moody's, Standard & Poors and Weiss for ratings nad write ups, but bear in mind that mainly the company has paid for these reports or provided most of the information, so it is not totally unbiased the exception probably being Weiss. Check with your State Dept of insurance for the results of investigations, and reason for fines. Do not rely on telephone CSRs get to the Depts that handle Investigations and Market Conduct. Also see what they filed with the State regarding Disputed and Resisted Claims. I think this is Schedule F or S. Do a Google search for complaints. Do a Google search for lawsuits against them, annuities, variable annuities and against annuity companies. There are many and the reasons should be relevant to what is being proposed to you.

I thought that Microsoft lost using that language etc.