PFranckowiak

Yes it is in the plan document. So I don't have to do an amendment? The highest number of hours people just happen to not have deferred. Retail business, so lots of part time people that float between 1000 hours one year and 900 hours another.

Language in the Plan Document If this Subsection applies and the Hours of Service method is used, then the Administrator will suspend the allocation conditions and expand the group of the "includible" Nonhighly Compensated Employees who are Participants by including the minimum number of Participants eligible to share in the contribution, beginning first with the "includible" Employees employed by the Employer on the last day of the Plan Year who have completed the greatest number of Hours of Service in the Plan Year, then the "includible" Employees who have completed the greatest number of Hours of Service during the Plan Year, and continuing to suspend the allocation conditions for each "includible" Employee who completed Hours of Service, from the greatest number of Hours of Service to the least, until the Plan satisfies the "ratio percentage test" for the Plan Year. If two or more "includible" Employees have the same number of Hours of Service, then the Administrator will suspend the allocation conditions for all such "includible" Employees, irrespective of whether the Plan can satisfy the "ratio percentage test" by accruing benefits for fewer than all such "includible" Employees. If the Plan for any Plan Year suspends the allocation conditions for an "includible" Employee, then that Employee will share in the allocation for that Plan Year of the Employer contribution and Forfeitures, if any, without regard to whether the Employee has satisfied the other allocation conditions set forth in this Section

Yes, but it fails worse without them.

12/17/2017 The company purchase another store. They merged the prior ER plan into their plan. The 13 employees were given service credit for vesting and eligibility and entered the plan 12/17/17. They were not given credit for service for contributions, the match, which has a 1000 hour requirement. Coverage fails by 3 participants. Options are: 1. If I exclude the 13 from coverage test, it still fails. 2. Amend the plan to included 3 more participants that have the most hours of service. These three have zero deferral. Therefore match would be zero. 3. Or could amend the plan to include the 13 new participants hours with the previous employer, all of which deferred. Do I have a problem doing this if the Match is discretionary and they gave us a dollar amount to allocate? Match has not yet been deposited. Average Benefits Test has been excluded as an option. Am I missing anything? I don't run across this much with the plans we have. I want to give the client some options.

Ok can he take all of Roth, and minimum required on Roth in 2017 and delay his minimum required on the Traditional money until 4/1/2018. He just turned 70.5. I.E. split the distribution of the Minimum Required into two years. Roth, this year and then next year will take two of the Traditional. Wants to do to put the regular into next tax year.

Thank you - just wanted to make sure and I couldn't find examples allowing it.

Thank you very much - that worked!

Plan Merger. Don't have money yet, cannot set up a takeover loan until money is transferred in. Participants already are having loan payments that we have just sitting in the account to set up the loan. Participant will not have much money when transferred in as they apparently took a hardship after the loan. If there is not a big enough balance, how do you force the loan to work. No help from Relius, said I had to put fake money in fake accounts. This is a large, audited daily plan, so I don't want to have "fake" accounts. Any ideas?

Plan document allows from All Sources. Says Plan Administrator can pick order. Participant is 70.5. Has been in Roth for over 5 years. Taking minimums and wants to move just Roth Money to Roth IRA to avoid future minimum required distributions on the Roth part. I think the document allows for it, just confused by some of the stuff I read about prorating in the Pension Answer book. I wanted to make sure we didn't have to prorate it between all of the sources.

Participant wants an inservice distribution. Has Traditional 401k, match and Roth. Can he take just his Roth out in as an inservice distribution. Everything I am finding deals with after-tax. Where would I find this? Hes an HCE.

Thanks for the help. CPA is filing for the QSLOB - so we will see what happens there. I recommended an Attorney get involved.

Mike - I didn't think you could combine a Safe Harbor Plan and a nonsafe harbor plan and pass coverage by the ABT? Looking at QSLOB but I'm trying to find the site that explains how to calculate the 50 employee requirement. Do you have to exclude those who have worked less than six months for the company from determining that count?

They already used that up.

Yes, I am worried about the 50 employee rule. Am I correct that you exclude employees with less that six months of service from the count? If so we only have 52 eligible with a quarterly entry date, no service. I thought I also read something about having to have 50 on every day of the plan year?

Who would be best to make the determination whether or not we could test two plans of a controlled group under a separate lines of business? Same ownership- separate companies located 150 miles apart. Erisa Attorney or clients CPA? Does that allow you to have one SH plan and one non Safe Harbor plan and what testing would have to be combined? Pat

Company A and Company B are a controlled group by a recent purchase. Company A has about 10 HCE 52 NHCE and is a SH nonelective Plan. (12/31/16) Company B has 2 HCE and 112 NHCE and is not a Safe Harbor Plan (12/31/16) I think there are two options since I cannot aggregate a Safe Harbor Plan and an nonsafeharbor plan. Plan A fails the Ration % test. 1. Company A has to drop Safe Harbor. Then ADP/ACP Test, Coverage Tests, Top Heavy Test would include all employees of both companies. 2. Company B must adopt Mirror plan of Company A - SH nonelective. 3. Combine into one plan - but plan would require an audit. Am I missing Anything? Thanks

Anyone having a long wait for support at Relius?

Participant terminated, but was rehired. He received his distribution after he was rehired as the client didn't realize he shouldn't get paid. He got paid in two parts. A rollover and a cash distribution. The exact dollar amount was returned from the plan he rolled into. (not any earnings). Not sure how they are handling it as far as 1099R. He got paid cash (Roth)- he paid 100% of the cash back, including the withholding on the earnings. So I think we still have to do 1099R for him, so that he can get his withholding back. But should we adjust that to show the distribution just being the withholding as the money is back into the plan? Also show as nontaxable distribution? Thanks

Seems like the ER is getting paid for their mistake! Since it has to be used as soon as possible, I assume we cannot wait and use it for the matching contribution for last year? They will be depositing that as late as they can. Otherwise since it was found after year end, it would be reducing contribution for the next year. Just want all options before I talk to the client about the correction.

So the interest earned should be used to offset the next contribution to the plan also?

I was not sure if we could use the entire amount for fees? I thought that since the $5,000 was deposited as a contribution, we would have to use that for a contribution.

They reported an extra $5,000 because the payroll person didn't take it off the deposit sheet from a previous deferral. It was never taken from the EE's pay.

The Employer incorrectly reported $5,000 too much deferral for a HCE. We are removing the $5,000 plus the interest that was accumulated to make his account accurate. The over contribution we are using to reduce the next contribution that the Employer makes. What options do we have for the interest. (It's several hundred dollars)?

I would have a discussion with them on the phone. TPA responsibility is to educate the client on the rules and penalties for not following the rules. That way I can see what their attitude is toward it. I would have a chance to explain the rules to them and why the contribution is late. Email just doesn't work to explain it as you cannot tell if they really understand. 1. Ball Park the interest and penalty and your fees and let them know it's less expensive than being caught in an audit with late contributions. They also are signing the 5500, knowing it's incorrect. 2. Make them sign something that you have notified them that the correct answer on the 5500 is late. You will mark the box not late per their instructions, but that you will take no liability for it nor or in the future. Not sure I would want to keep a client that would not listen to me.

I think you can find a calculator on http://www.401khelpcenter.com/401k/pension_online_solok_calculator.html#.WPi300uGOUk I always check it for accuracy, but it gives you a start.