Lifetime Income Disclosures - Tables for Calculations

Is anyone aware of where I can get my hands on a table to calculate the lifetime income figures?  I have a couple of plans where we're not using Relius, so I want to be able to calculate the disclosures manually.

Anyone know where I can get those tables?  I mean they must be out there somewhere...

The more I think about it, the crazier it seems that there are not "safe harbor tables" that we can all use.  It seems to me that there should be consistency from plan to plan to make sure there are apples to apples comparisons.  One person with $10,000 in 2 separate 401k plans might be told 2 very different things about wwhat their monthly income might be...  Especially if the interest assumptions are quite different and the employee is young.

Comparability of illustrations would result if plans’ administrators obey the rule.

If two individual-account retirement plans (neither of which allows an annuity payout) furnish the rule’s required lifetime-income illustrations for:

the same last day of the statement period,

the same account balance,

the same age for the participant, and

neither participant is older than 67,

the illustrations would show the same amounts if both plans’ administrators completely and accurately follow the rule.

This is so because a plan’s administrator lacks discretion in setting assumptions for the required illustration. The rule sets those assumptions.

The assumed interest rate is “the 10-year constant maturity Treasury securities yield rate for the first business day of the last month of the period to which the benefit statement relates[.]” For example, an illustration generated from a statement for the quarter-year ending December 30, 2022 would assume for the interest rate the 10-year CMT yield on December 1, 2022.

29 C.F.R. § 2520.105-3 https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-29/subtitle-B/chapter-XXV/subchapter-C/part-2520/section-2520.105-3

Explanation https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2020-09-18/pdf/2020-17476.pdf

Some practitioners guess the first few years’ illustrations likely will involve several kinds of errors or other failures. That can happen with any new rule. But Congress decided it would be worthwhile to try something.

Does Relius have any sort of capability to calculate an annuity purchase rate (APR)? If so just plug in the relevant interest rate and mortality table. Take the account balance and divide it by the APR to get the lifetime income amount.

If not (and I find that hard to believe), I posted a spreadsheet a while back that will calculate APRs for you. You will need to get the values for the mortality table from the relevant IRS notice or elsewhere.

yeah that's not practical for my nonactuarial mind 😂  If there was a table I could download once a month from actuaries.com or something with the factors now we're talking about my skill set!  I see now that the interest that needs to be used will fluctiate so the APRs will fluctuate.  Seems nuts that the DOL wouldn't issue an RMD factor style table for this.  What is John Doe the Plumber supposed to do if his money is in Fidelity brokerage accounts?

Relius can do it.  (ya know, because it's just one interest rate and not segments....)  But I *am* surprised not to see any sort of printed-off list at this point with the factors based on interest/mortality required for a 12/31/21 statement.  One column for the SLA and one for the QJSA presuming an identically-aged spouse.

Right??  Why isn't that an obvious necessity??

Mike Preston (?) uploaded an excel file to calculate these "manually".

The problem is that it will vary from month to month because of the floating interest rates.  They gave us a calculator to make sure that if $100 is late to the plan they get every penny of interest (both of them).  But helping people project income to retirement?  "Oh just modify a mortality table for an interest rate adjustment.  Didn't you learn anything in elementary  school?"

20 hours ago, imchipbrown said:

Mike Preston (?) uploaded an excel file to calculate these "manually".

No, it was C.B. Zeller who did that. My program that is commercially available can do it but you shouldn't have to purchase a program to do this when every administative system will do it for you, too.

Sorry Mike.  

About 3½ years after this discussion left off, have tools for computing the required lifetime-income illustrations developed?

For the plans I was referring to where  I am doing the LTI disclosures outside of Relius, I found a way to export all of the amounts that I needed into an Excel spreadsheet.  I was never able to automate the calculation (nor did I need to because I could pull them from Relius).

Our actuary provides an Excel spreadsheet with the factors (which takes them about 5 minutes) and we import the factors into the report writer that applies them to the participant's account balance when it generates the disclosures.