thepensionmaven Posted August 3, 2022 Posted August 3, 2022 We have a SHNE no PS. Client (with "help" from broker) decided to add voluntary contributions up to the 415 limit. Three owners, two are doing the max up to $62K between elective, SH and voluntary. To play it safe, ran both ADP and ACP tests, apparently plan passes both on the basis that the unused portion of the employee deferrals were moved over to pass ACP. Does this make any sense?
C. B. Zeller Posted August 3, 2022 Posted August 3, 2022 You can't shift contributions between the ADP and ACP tests unless both tests are using the same method. Since the ADP test is being satisfied by the safe harbor non-elective contribution (regardless of whether the ADP test would have passed without the safe harbor), I think that prevents you from shifting contributions. Bill Presson, MWeddell and Luke Bailey 3 Free advice is worth what you paid for it. Do not rely on the information provided in this post for any purpose, including (but not limited to): tax planning, compliance with ERISA or the IRC, investing or other forms of fortune-telling, bird identification, relationship advice, or spiritual guidance. Corey B. Zeller, MSEA, CPC, QPA, QKA Preferred Pension Planning Corp.corey@pppc.co
Belgarath Posted August 4, 2022 Posted August 4, 2022 Agreed. See 1.401(m)-2(a)(6)(ii). Bri and Luke Bailey 2
thepensionmaven Posted August 4, 2022 Author Posted August 4, 2022 OK, elective contributions have been tested ADP and it passes. Another TPA informed me with SECURE 2.0, a QNEC (in this case, let's say 3% what we're using as 3% safe harbor with all the restrictions of the safe harbor as far as in-service and hardships) can be used to pass ACP. Is this not the case?
Bri Posted August 4, 2022 Posted August 4, 2022 Well, SECURE 2.0 hasn't become law yet, but generally a plan may include a QNEC to help to pass the ACP test in lieu of refunds. (See what your plan document may already allow, or if a plan amendment would be needed to customize something more tailored for your sponsor's wishes.) Luke Bailey 1
Bill Presson Posted August 4, 2022 Posted August 4, 2022 2 hours ago, thepensionmaven said: OK, elective contributions have been tested ADP and it passes. Why does this matter? Luke Bailey 1 William C. Presson, ERPA, QPA, QKA bill.presson@gmail.com C 205.994.4070
MWeddell Posted August 4, 2022 Posted August 4, 2022 4 hours ago, thepensionmaven said: OK, elective contributions have been tested ADP and it passes. I agree with BIll Preston that it doesn't matter. The plan document says (presumably) that the plan meets the 401(k) safe harbor conditions and therefore an ADP test is not required. Presumably the plan year you are concerned with has ended so that it is too late to amend the plan document.
cpc0506 Posted August 6, 2022 Posted August 6, 2022 Can I add my two cents here? If I am understanding the issue, I think it needs to be clear that the SH 3% is used to satisfy the ADP safe harbor. Plan now has ACP testing since voluntary deferrals are included in the ACP test. So an additional QMAC contribution would need to be made to pass the ACP test . You cannot count the SH twice. Bill Presson 1
thepensionmaven Posted August 7, 2022 Author Posted August 7, 2022 The safe harbor 3% has been used to satisfy the ACP test.
Bill Presson Posted August 8, 2022 Posted August 8, 2022 6 hours ago, thepensionmaven said: The safe harbor 3% has been used to satisfy the ACP test. The voluntary after tax contributions then have to satisfy another ACP test on their own. acm_acm 1 William C. Presson, ERPA, QPA, QKA bill.presson@gmail.com C 205.994.4070
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