Plan Term Lost Partic no SSN

Plan terminated a bunch of years ago, and accounts were paid out in drips and drabs. 

The only accounts left are for the owners and several people who left the company long ago (like 2010, 2011-ish).

The employer doesn't have SSN for these people, so rollover places wont take the accounts.

Pooled PSP, not at a nat'l provider or anything like that.

What becomes of those accounts?

Look for 'em?

And recognize that the plan, even if discontinued, is not yet terminated.

My client only has names like L Ramirez born in the 1970's sometime, or S Kelly born in 1981 as records.  No SSNs.

What happens then?

Can't even escheat to the state w/out an SSN.

I wonder if a PEP Plan for missing participants may someday appear. Getting scale would be a problem, but it would be a way for employers to bail out of situations like this.

They have put themselves in a bad place by prior bad decisions.    How did they pay them when working without a SSN?   Before everyone else was paid out declare them lost and it would have looked less self serving to forfeit and reallocate to all the rank and file mostly. 

At this point it is a bad choice by declare them lost participants and follow what the document says to do if that happens.    Hopefully it says forfeit and reallocate.  Not pretty but I don't see how you fix it since they don't have a SSN.   

I am not saying it is a good answer.  Nor can I cite anything to support it.   Likewise, I think a DOL auditor or IRS auditor will not like the answer. 

But the right answer was in the past- get the SSN when you hire them and no one can go back in time and do that. 

Maybe the problem originated with a prior record-keeper?  Find out who that was, and ask for help?

BG, this is not a slam on you, but I find it impossible to believe they can't track down a w-2 anywhere. Payroll company? CPA? Nobody?

No records left for these people.  Company closed up in 2011.  Nothing in the r/k system here.  Been here since mid-2000's.

I think sending them to an ERISA Atty may be a good idea.

As to the plan doc:

Quote

3.11.7 Missing Persons. If the Trustee mails by registered or certified mail, postage prepaid, to the last
known address of a Participant or Beneficiary, a notification that the Participant or Beneficiary is entitled to
a distribution and if (a) the notification is returned by the post office because the addressee cannot be
located at such address and if neither the Employer, the Plan Administrator nor the Trustee shall have any
knowledge of the whereabouts of such Participant or Beneficiary within three (3) years from the date such
notification was mailed, or (b) within three (3) years after such notification was mailed to such Participant or
Beneficiary, he does not respond thereto by informing the Trustee of his whereabouts, the ultimate
disposition of the then undistributed vested Account balance of such Participant or Beneficiary shall be
determined in accordance with the then applicable Federal laws, rules, and regulations.

If I read the circumstances correctly (Pooled PSP), these employees are in a MEP established under pre-SECURE Act law? 

Church, the assets of the plan are in an employer-directed pooled account.  Not individual accounts.

Certainly not a MEP.

Employer says they do not have the records.  Also says these employees may have had fake SSNs.  Small employer, I doubt they vigorously examined the employment status of their hires.

Sounds like a Plan Administrator who took their ERISA duty to retain records required to pay all benefits as merely a suggestion. Does the Employer truly not have the records or do they just not want to search for them? Like are they in some storage they don't want to wade through or were they actually destroyed? Because like someone above mentioned I find it hard to believe there were no W-2s issued for the participants in question.

The PBGC missing participant program is not an option because no SSNs? The MP-200 and its instructions seem to assume you have an SSN, but they don't specifically say you can't use if you don't have. You might call them.

On 2/8/2021 at 3:31 PM, BG5150 said:

The employer doesn't have SSN for these people, so rollover places wont take the accounts.

I guess we are past the point of asking how they hired, paid and withheld taxes for someone without a SSN...

Contact the Berwyn Group.  They can research SSNs for lost participants 

27 minutes ago, Kyle - Berwyn Group said:

Contact the Berwyn Group.  They can research SSNs for lost participants 

Can you do that for people who have passed decades ago?   

37 minutes ago, Kyle - Berwyn Group said:

Contact the Berwyn Group.  They can research SSNs for lost participants 

My problem is that the ER doesn't have the SSNs.

4 hours ago, BG5150 said:

My problem is that the ER doesn't have the SSNs.

I think by "research SSNs" Kyle means come up with some SSN candidates based on the info you do have, BG5150.

12 hours ago, Luke Bailey said:

I think by "research SSNs" Kyle means come up with some SSN candidates based on the info you do have, BG5150.

We have stuff like:

L Ramirez DOB 1971

You may want to try to contact a professional search firm like PBI and see if they can provide you with some potential matches.

5 hours ago, BG5150 said:

We have stuff like:

L Ramirez DOB 1971

You also have his or her last address, right? Maybe whom he or she designated as a beneficiary? Job description.

It's a big data world.

The Berwyn Group can research participant SSNs directly through the SSA or through commercial credit agencies even if you have limited data on file .  The key data points that Berwyn would request would be Name, DOB, and Last Known Address.  If the person you have no SSN for has been deceased for decades, they will not be active in commercial data sources BUT, Berwyn can likely correct the SSN be searching the SSA Death Master File (DMF).